The conversation on diversity has been going for decades. Lauren Mua speaks to Mel & Dom about Progressive Diversity. She has seen and experienced changes in the industry during her 10+ years as an engineer.
I put progressive in front of that diversity, because I see it as something that … is about moving forward, promoting change and improving our current diverse industry
Lauren says she stumbled into engineering. When she was in high school she was a bit lost, so went to visit her school councillor. The councellorasked her to fill out a quiz, which advised her to do a bachelor of engineering and commerce from University of Queensland… which is exactly what she ended up doing!
there was no talk about engineering and construction for women at an all girls school
Extra discussions during the episode
Future: Continued diversity in the workforce.
I think there’s so much more work to do to get there
Advice: Engineering is such a diverse industry, there’s lot of tasks to chose from
engineering is just such a great industry to be in for any kind of personality, in any kind of walk of life
The torso building designed by Santiago Calatrava
the building… it looks like a male torso, that’s been twisted
… she’s a social advocate. So she stands up for diversity and women’s rights and that kind of thing. But she’s also an incredibly successful engineer. She works on oil rigs, out off the coast of Australia.
Lauren is a Civil Engineer with a Bachelor’s degree in Engineering and a Bachelor of Commerce (majoring in finance) from the University of Queensland.
She has nine years’ experience working at national construction company, BMD where she is currently a Senior Project Engineer based in Brisbane. Lauren’s career has spanned across airport, defence, renewable energy, bulk earthworks, bridge, drainage and sewer projects.
Lauren is passionate about improving gender diversity in engineering, encouraging young engineers to take on challenges to better their careers and achieving innovative sustainable outcomes for her clients.
Dominic De Gioia is the Director of a multi-discipline engineering firm, Epicentre Consulting Engineers. He is a mechanical engineer with specialist experience in hydraulic engineering.
Melanie De Gioia is the Podcast Producer for Engineers Australia and the Director of Ramaley Media.
Together, Mel & Dom launched Engineering Heroes on 20 June 2018
This is a “close” copy of the words that were spoken during the Podcast, Season 5 Episode 13
It is not 100% accurate.
The guest was Lauren Mua
Lauren: [00:00:00] I guess it’s in hindsight now that I’ve actually had a career as an engineer that that quiz you know picked up on things That makes sense as an engineer. So when I was younger you know I loved maths, big into sport, I was big into playing basketball so I love team sports. I gravitated to a lot of leadership roles and that sort of thing, And that kind of is exactly what an engineer is. You know I think that’s some defining things for what a lot of engineers are.
[00:00:28]And my dad was also a carpenter growing up. Back in the day when you’re allowed to use to go to all the building sites with him. And I love that side of things and you know my mom was also a really good influence. She really pushed me into leadership roles and supported me in that And I just think, that’s what really led me to engineering and that’s what makes our job really good
[00:00:48] Mel: [00:00:48] That’s amazing Yeah I’m just I’m circling back to that whole careers advisor, because we have had some people tell us about how pivotal a careers advisor has been in their life and either in a high school or a bit later in life some sort of career counselors.. So it’s amazing that you’ve been guided so well so early.
[00:01:07]Dom: [00:01:07] And to just for them to get it so right So it’s like yep That’s the one I’m doing done
[00:01:13] Lauren: [00:01:13] Absolutely And I went to an all girl’s school. So yeah And it was over 10 years ago. So like engineering definitely wasn’t an avenue that was really told to us. A lot of it was like teaching and nursing which are really respectable professions, but there was no talk about engineering and construction for women at an all girls school. So, yeah it was very lucky how I ended up as an engineer
[00:01:38]Dom: [00:01:38] So after you finished the UQ, do you remember what the first project that you worked on was
[00:01:42]Lauren: [00:01:42] Yeah so I started with BMD. And I could go straight to the first boots on the ground project I did uh the really exciting stuff but so that’s a touch from the first year my first taste of engineering I was in their group systems, management system side of things. And I was at an interesting time for BMD because they didn’t have an integrated national business system. Everyone was sort of running off their own spreadsheets and their own procedures.
[00:02:12]We had our own overarching values and policies, but we didn’t have the integrated system and a lot of texts. So I spent the first year helping them write a little bit their initial procedures. uh to develop check that worked into our SharePoint environment that we use all the time. So it was great having that first year in the business management systems because when I actually went to my first project, I was able just to sort of hit the ground running and learn A lot of the onsite things that engineers need to get into.
[00:02:44]Mel: [00:02:44] Did you say that was your first year like you were a first year uni student when you were doing that
[00:02:49] Lauren: [00:02:49] Uh I think it was about third year Yeah third year And then my first my first real boots on the ground project was at the Brisbane airport. We did the DFO there, so it was a road upgrade So it was Well electrical, sewer, storm water, bulk earthworks side of things. And I was in the BMD urban side of the business. So you usually run a couple of projects at the same time which was now completely thrown in the deep end to try to do that. So I was also on the RAF base at Amberley doing a big bowl earthworks and payments job out there. So yeah I loved it It was it was really good
[00:03:25] Mel: [00:03:25] That does sound it sounds amazing. Even just the connection you made between you when your first kind of role was, I’m going to assume very office spaced getting in the behind the scenes systems and stuff but then when you did what’d you say boots on the ground you actually it gave you that understanding of how things work on site. So that’s actually quite a good connection of two first roles in a way. That’s brilliant. Now I know you’ve traveled a little bit between then and now but tell us about where you are now, because you’re back there aren’t you?
[00:03:55]Lauren: [00:03:55] Yes I spent eight years in the urban sector of BMD doing subdivisions, roads, bridges. And then I left for about two years to go into the renewable space. I think I just wanted a complete change new challenge. and then yeah the last two years I’ve been back at BMD, I think it’s just where my heart was in my passion and the company. I left on really good terms and I wanted to come back to so to come back home for them. And so I’ve been on the Carmichael rail project uh for them which is another FIFO role for the last year two years
[00:04:30]Mel: [00:04:30] I know you said your heart’s there and stuff, but doing renewals getting that opportunity to work in the renewables field but then you came back to BMD which is a bit more traditional perhaps. I’m trying to work out what the conscious decision was there.
[00:04:43]Lauren: [00:04:43] Yeah, there definitely was a conscious decision. Like I sat On that for probably six months. I was doing wind farms, and I was doing the civil side of wind farms. And you know once you’ve kind of built one turbine of 70, by the 20th turbine it’s kind of the you know it’s uh Yeah Wash thing Yeah. Uh and then. Well the good thing about coming back to BMD is rather than come back to the urban division, I came back to their construction division. Which I guess people wouldn’t know it’s it’s the big large infrastructure projects. So it’s a lot bigger projects. So it’s like rail, you know, big bridges, TMR work, which is like RMS work in new South Wales. So um I guess I Did it feel like or was it going to keep growing by coming back to BMD
[00:05:31] Yes that makes
[00:05:33] Dom: [00:05:33] So the the FIFO side of things. Is that something that you’re happy doing or do you think that that’s something like that That’s probably going to a limited lifespan? For me it’s always a case of when I was doing a lot of travel that when planes become just a big bus in the air after a while then it gets to the point where it’s like I’m done.
[00:05:48] Lauren: [00:05:48] Yeah well the 20th it feels normal. And then with all this COVID business going around it, yeah really made things hard. Yeah for me, I think I’ve done it for four years now, and for me it has a life span, like I do want to settle back in Brisbane and be home every night and you know look to start a family in then the next few years. So definitely about I’ve met men and women who are there for 10 years and they couldn’t think of doing anything else
[00:06:23] Yeah So um without thinking about the challenge or this podcast uh it just happened to be international women’s week And
[00:06:32] I attended a uh event by engineers Australia, and it was hosted by doctor Bronwyn Evans Who’s the CEO of engineer Australia, as you guys know. And she I think the event with a statistic that 13.6% of engineers are women. And my first thought was, like I’m not surprised because often I’m in a meeting and I’m the only female and that’s just normal. And then my second thought was like, well hang on It’s probably not right That I just think that’s normal and that’s accepted as the norm.
[00:07:03] And so the topic I really wanted to talk to you guys about is progressive diversity. And I guess I put progressive in front of that diversity, because I see it as something that you know is about moving forward, promoting change and improving our current diverse industry at the moment.
[00:07:20]Mel: [00:07:20] What do you mean by progressive? Cause that seems like a movement thing
[00:07:24]Lauren: [00:07:24] By progressive, I think, like I was saying it means you know moving forward promoting change. And I think it’s about building on what we’ve already done and what I’ve seen already happen in the last 10 years. Be it slow, I’ve seen our industry become a lot more diverse. When I was coming through I was definitely one of the only female engineers and out division. Now there’s probably about 10 of us, so there’s a big change. And I think it’s about you know trying to keep building the workforce up diversely, whether it be you know based on gender cultures religion geography. And it’s about trying to move forward to like how do we do that?
[00:08:03]Mel: [00:08:03] I really liked the way you answered that question because it is it’s you can sort of wave the flag for diversity as much as you like. But to your point progressive diversity it means you’re building, you’re moving on, You’re progressing you’re moving forward You’re building on the past and going forward. So I quite liked the movement angle in that as well.
[00:08:24] So Tell us a bit more about your thoughts on this issue and progressive diversity
[00:08:29]Lauren: [00:08:29] Well I guess, I first tried to look at it from three different angles. And there’s different perspectives you can look at it from. And I wanted to look at it from a female perspective, I guess, based on my own experience. You know, from the male’s perspective as best as I possibly could. And from my company’s perspective, the lack of diversity.
[00:08:47] And from my own experiences, and as I become more of a senior project engineer, I’ve had a lot of young women, whether they’d be at work in my life and our friends or family, come with me with you know a lot of real issues that I’ve had is being a female. It has been hardish to talk about like sexual harassment whether that be physical verbal. They have been overlooked for their male counterparts, And when you put the resumes you know in equal weigh them, you know she comes out as more qualified every time. And I guess, by having young women come to me it’s made me look back on my career retrospectively, and I think I’ve had a lot of fantastic men that I have worked with who have only ever empowered with me to get to where I am today and I’ve loved working with them. But I have had some pretty dicey moments over the last 10 years where either I have been grabbed at pre-start inappropriately in front of like a lot of other men. I have had Sexual comments thrown at me in front of clients, And it really so that discredits my position and those really kind of horrible things. So, how do we change that? How do we make that better? What are the solutions so that doesn’t happen, because honestly, me every day, I love what I do. I love working as an engineer and I don’t see that a lot, but it is still an issue.
[00:10:11] And then I guess from the man’s point of view, and I don’t know if Dom you know the statistic as well, is that you know every second day we lose a man to suicide in construction, so construction is like, the leading industry in Australia for suicide
[00:10:29] Dom: [00:10:29] it’s a massive issue
[00:10:31] Lauren: [00:10:31] Massive issue. And I think a lot of it from what the studies they’ve done you know we partner with mates in construction. They’re really great outlet, yeah a lot of men in construction, and women, like they open to women as well. And they’ve found that a lot of it comes down to this toxic masculinity, you know this macho sort of not being able to speak out. Sort of hiding your feelings And have a pocket of concrete and move on and that kind of thing. And that sort of just internalizes a lot of stuff for men.
[00:11:00]And then I guess from the point of view from a company. The market is so competitive at the moment, absolutely competitive. How do companies separate themselves from each other? And I think a lot of it has to do with innovation. And I know that clients are pushing us, more so today, hit deadlines and hit budget all at the same time. So how do you do that? And I think what we’re looking to do is is try to innovate.
[00:11:29]Dom: [00:11:29] Do you find that it’s becoming more commonplace as well That employees really they want to work with companies that obviously are embracing that change in regards to not only innovation but diversity in the workplace and giving back to the industry, whether it’s through grassroots encouragement of bringing more men and women into engineering? Is that sort of something that entices employees more than just the age old kind of engineer where it was just like well yeah you’re going to come and work with us and you know do what you need to do. people are looking for those sorts of challenges and those sorts of ideals that fit the Mark that they want to leave on society?
[00:12:10] Lauren: [00:12:10] Yeah I think Absolutely. I think that my generation and the new generation coming through. I think that innovation and diversity are massive with them. And I think that even comes down to Maybe social media, it’s helping people connect around the world and see people’s lives from different points of view, different cultures. And the world’s your oyster. So I guess companies can’t just, you know hit you with a salary and you know, hit you at this project. They kind of need to be more creative nowadays, based on the content that is out there at the moment. And I think a lot of it has to do with innovation and diversity. And I think you know there’s a study, they looked at the Forbes SP 500 companies, they did a study of those companies, and they found that, if the company had above average diversity in their company, they were 19% more innovative.
[00:13:05] Mel: [00:13:05] I have
[00:13:07] Lauren: [00:13:07] that directly linked to a better financial performance, As well. So you know there’s actually benefit to the company, as well. Not just for compliance to have you know numbers of different diversities but there’s actually like a benefit to them to be diverse
[00:13:23]Mel: [00:13:23] Yeah
[00:13:24]Dom: [00:13:24] it’s one of those things that, People are starting to realize that as well And it’s great that those facts and figures are out there. Although it’s one of those things where you just sort of go why aren’t you doing it anyway It’s kind of it’s nice to have the well. As engineers It’s always nice to have the data behind it too so that
[00:13:40] Lauren: [00:13:40] Yeah I think that’s why I fall back below the Dava Yes
[00:13:45] Dom: [00:13:45] It’s how it makes a world of difference. It’s very hard to to look at those numbers and that data and continue to put your head in the sand.
[00:13:53] Mel: [00:13:53] Is there anything that you think that you’ve seen that has really worked in championing and building on that Diversity in engineering
[00:14:01]Lauren: [00:14:01] yeah definitely. I think, I’m gonna focus a bit more on the female side of things, although diversity, across the board, there’s many solutions. But I sort of narrowed it down to five that jumped to mind. And that’s culture, opportunity, leadership, flexibility and quotas.
[00:14:20] And when that talks about culture it’s about a company like what you’re talking about before Dom, it’s a company and the HR. Being aware that diversity is such a benefit, but also then not having any tolerance for any sorts of racism or sexism or anything that might happen. And having a HR department that really backs you and makes you feel comfortable. And I think at least as a female you know we would draw a lot more women to our industry, If they knew that they company has had their back a hundred percent if anything did happen.
[00:14:51] Dom: [00:14:51] Yeah point I think I may have to jump over to when your next points, but the leadership one as well. So having a company with leadership that, like I say you know the culture starts from the top. So ensuring that the leadership team are promoting that and you know that they’re on your side as well and that what they stand for, that speaks volumes.
[00:15:16] Lauren: [00:15:16] Absolutely. Yeah And then in BMD in particular, and again a big reason why I came back, is we have such great male champions who really support that and really support women. And the CEO gets involved once a month with the most senior women at the company, and just says you know what can we do to help? How can we promote well women’s the business How can we support our women better? And knowing that your own CEO of a massive company is really buying into that, it it makes you really feel great to be a part of this industry and this company. Yeah
[00:15:51]Mel: [00:15:51] So some of the other points as well I’d love to hear your thoughts on those
[00:15:54] Lauren: [00:15:54] Yeah so opportunity. And I think that’s just as simple as trying to get out to high schools and try and you know maybe even particular female high schools or high schools, So they’re in you know different diverse suburbs and just trying to promote you know engineering as an option even. And I think you know I like was saying before there’s an incentive to companies To be more diverse. It’d be great to see companies even just send their people out to do talks at the local high school and those kinds of things
[00:16:23] Mel: [00:16:23] Yeah I actually believe that’s very true as well, And there’s a company, Power of Engineering that I volunteered for, And they do just that thing. They’re so aligned to what you were just talking about how it’s all about going out to those schools and communicating about engineering. And they have such a big uplift They have this survey that they ask at the beginning of the day going how many people here want to be engineers And they get like 10% 15% something like that. And then by the end of the day where they’ve gone through this program and they’ve gone on the site tour and all this sort of stuff they asked the same question and it’s it’s like 80%. And it’s such a massive uplift from just one day of just being out there and showing them what it’s about and educating and showing them the opportunity of what engineering is all about. So I completely agree that that is a really big solution.
[00:17:13] Lauren: [00:17:13] Yeah I’m going to ask you the details of that off to you after this Yeah definitely
[00:17:18]Mel: [00:17:18] So tell us about the other last two on those that list of five
[00:17:23] Lauren: [00:17:23] Yeah So the second last one is flexibility, and it’s all about return to work. And even what I’ve seen in the last 10 years in the industry, and , you know, even at BMD in particular, there was no such thing as casual or part-time work. and that was probably reflective of the industry at the time. And so we lose a lot of women who have families From the business, because there’s no opportunity for them to return. But what I’ve seen is, paternity leave and maternity leave they kind of one and the same Now. They talk more about uh
[00:17:55] Mel: [00:17:55] leave
[00:17:56] Lauren: [00:17:56] yeah Parental leave and primary carer. So that option has definitely improved. But I think companies again just need to look at their flexibility. How can they work in having women or men returned back to work only three days a week or four days a week, so that they can take care of their family? So we’re not losing people from the industry for that you know people who do want to come back and and continue that career
[00:18:17] Mel: [00:18:17] I think also on that, COVID has shown the world how flexible People can be and still maintain a working environment. And in most cases or in a majority of cases that it can be successful as well or it’s not going to kill a company, because the whole world’s done it now And a lot of has survived.
[00:18:41]Dom: [00:18:41] and particularly that returned to work, there are so few engineers out there, it’s such a massive resource, And such a massive pool of talent out there, that just because they don’t fit into the standard, nine to five, five days a week of traditional employment, it doesn’t mean that uh sort of work around that in order to then be able to to have such a great workforce too. You know, the The last thing you really want to do is pass up on this exceptional talent just because people need to fit in with school runs or you know they need to look after children or Oh look after um parents for that matter So
[00:19:18] Mel: [00:19:18] If It only benefits the industry to offer that flexibility.
[00:19:21] Lauren: [00:19:21] Definitely Yeah I think I think you both spoke to one of our national managers Craig Smith the other week and he was talking about the severe skill shortage. So that really ties in to retain people and the good resources that we have and in some of these people, you know, they leave So the early thirties families you know that 10 years plus experience that we lose
[00:19:41] Mel: [00:19:41] Exactly Exactly And you don’t need to it with a little bit of flexibility built into the system You don’t need to do that. You can keep the brain keep the brains where they need to be. So And what was that last point
[00:19:53] Lauren: [00:19:53] the last one was quotas. And they’re a bit taboo. And I don’t like
[00:20:01] Mel: [00:20:01] but they’re bad
[00:20:02] Lauren: [00:20:02] Yes I don’t like them at face value, at all. But then, what I think they promote, and I guess, for engineers is you know we have targets and percentages . So you know we have to make our profit margin or whatever that percentage might be. We have to you know hit a certain amount of reduce incidences, which whatever that percentage might be. And so I kind of see this as a target and when we have targets in our industry, we Build programs around it to achieve it. And I think what quotas do promote, is companies putting in diversity training, or seeking out female engineers or whoever it might be. So at face value no I don’t like them because I think it goes off merit and equal weighting when you put the resume side by side, but what they promote and as just a number we’ll target to engineers that we are so used to or is trying to reach for that goal. yeah I I do support them at the end of the day.
[00:21:02] Dom: [00:21:02] Yeah I really like that I hadn’t thought about that but the way that by implementing them, it makes you develop the systems to actually achieve them.
[00:21:10] Mel: [00:21:10] Well
[00:21:11] Dom: [00:21:11] them That’s that’s a really really good point.
[00:21:12] Mel: [00:21:12] A temporary solution at the end of the day because you want to be able to get to a point where you don’t need to specify these quotas because you’ve lifted it up so much but it’s it’s one of those necessary evils for a temporary time. And it forces the embedding of an action that you hope will become a standard action later on
[00:21:34] Lauren: [00:21:34] the norm
[00:21:35] Mel: [00:21:35] Yeah exactly until until it’s not necessary anymore or until maybe it flips the other way So it could be a case of you have to do 50/ 50 and you know one day it might be a case of there’s you know 70% females and 30% males at the table It’s like well yeah we’ve got this diversity clause in here and let’s work it the other way
[00:21:54] Lauren: [00:21:54] Yeah exactly Yeah
[00:21:55] Mel: [00:21:55] who knows I like it’s it’s I think it’s a necessary evil Potentially like it does great things by embedding an action, but it’s something that, to your point, you do need to keep an eye on it because you want to get the best person for the job but
[00:22:12] Dom: [00:22:12] But hopefully it’ll it’ll then it’ll also encourage more of the likes of power of engineering, where it’s like okay we need to get more people into engineering. We need to we need to get more diversity in engineering. Yeah So then it actually gives you a call to action. So it’s not all just about the documentation It’s also about the industry
[00:22:35]Lauren: [00:22:35] I guess putting my engineering hat on. It’s a target And when we have targets and our business we you know we put an action plan together and it draws us to try to reach it. So when I look at it that way it’s great
[00:22:49] Dom: [00:22:49] Yep
[00:22:50] Mel: [00:22:50] So what would you think on the future of engineering
[00:22:53]Lauren: [00:22:53] Yes I guess, we are still keeping in theme I think that we will see a really diverse workforce. I think there’s so much more work to do to get there , but every 10 years is definitely improving. You know I watched a great Ted talk from Roccio Lorenzo. And she did a study in Europe and she found that if a company had over 20% Diversity and leadership, that they were much more successful Like I spoke about in the innovation and financial space. So I guess there’s definitely that aspect I’d love to see for the future of engineering. Something may be more tangible, I think is the innovation in earthworks and in particularly earthworks machines and autonomous machines and and drones that up just so part of our civil bulk earthworks crew, which again wasn’t even thing really you know five to 10 years
[00:23:43] Mel: [00:23:43] about to say not even five years ago Yeah
[00:23:45] Lauren: [00:23:45] Yeah definitely And I that was a poor fellow surveyor out there trying to pick up every point and then take him so long. Now it’s just fly this little drone and it’s got like a great you know plus or minus 5% accuracy and we’re there. So yeah I think that’s going to be an exciting, really tangible space that we can watch
[00:24:01] Dom: [00:24:01] so what would you say to engineers that are just starting out I want to sort of right at the beginning of their career
[00:24:07]Lauren: [00:24:07] Yeah, I’ll tell them that it’s an incredibly challenging Industry, and that’s what is probably the best part of it, And that’s what most of us love. And just stick to the work because engineering itself funny enough, is such a diverse profession. So if you’re introverted you know and you love getting into the detail, there’s design roles that you can go into, there’s consultancy roles that you can go into. If you’re extroverted and you love people and you love working with people, Project-based might be more specific to you, you know, whether it be civil or mechanical engineering. So I think engineering is just such a great industry to be in for any kind of personality, in any kind of walks of life
[00:24:49]Mel: [00:24:49] I’d love to hear a piece of engineering that has impressed you
[00:24:53]Lauren: [00:24:53] So funny enough when I was in uni we had a similar course that we studied, where we had to choose a piece of engineering. And I look back on that because it was a light bulb moment that I realized the capability of what engineers do. And what it is It’s A building that was designed by Santiago Calatrava. I hope I said that right. And he’s a Spanish architect, engineer and sculptor so completely overqualified Um and he did a sculpture of a twisting torso. So it’s like a man Um and he’s twisted about 90 degrades And anyway he was contacted by a local artist and I ended up turning that into a building. So the building was built in Sweden and I think 2005. And the building it looks like a male torso, That’s been twisted. And from top to bottom it’s a 90 degrees twist, and it’s 190 meters tall. And It’s a massive residential block of apartments and it just looks Absolutely amazing. And I thought seeing it go from it being a sculpture to that, I was like is this what engineers are capable of? Is this what we can do And that just really impressed me at that time
[00:26:08] Dom: [00:26:08] That’d be amazing We’ll definitely be Googling that as soon as we
[00:26:13] Mel: [00:26:13] Although I do have to one of the thoughts is like how livable is it Like you know as it’s like Oh I got the belly button bit it’s so dark in here I want to be up on the shoulder onto the collarbone Yeah that kind of
[00:26:27] Lauren: [00:26:27] Yeah well I think it overlooks at Bay so I’m sure they all want you know the ocean view from whatever part
[00:26:33] Mel: [00:26:33] Oh definitely It definitely worth a Google that one, because I had not heard of that. Thank you for that.
[00:26:37] Dom: [00:26:37] And just to finish up is there an engineer that you admire
[00:26:40]Lauren: [00:26:40] I have a few and to start with I admire… Her name’s Yassmin Abdel-Magied, have you heard of her
[00:26:48] Dom: [00:26:48] Yes the name sounds very
[00:26:50] Lauren: [00:26:50] Yeah So she’s seen these Australian, and she won the 2010 young Queensland of the year, in 2015 young Queensland Australia of the year. And she’s a social advocate, So she stands up for diversity and women’s rights and that kind of thing. But she’s also incredibly successful engineer. She works on oil rigs, Out off the coast of Australia. Yeah worked her way up to run their own section on the oil rig. So very successful woman, but she just speaks out for I guess those that don’t have a voice and really leads away on that.
[00:27:27] Mel: [00:27:27] Oh she sounds amazing Yeah I haven’t heard what was her name again
[00:27:34]Mel: [00:27:34] Okay Well another one that’s very Google worthy So
[00:27:38] Lauren: [00:27:38] she is and she’s She talks a lot about the unconscious bias. And I love the way that she this. Yes And I love the way she describes it because she describes it as it’s not a bad thing It’s just a natural thing. It’s the way that we see the world through our own lenses. And it’s based on the night where we were born and how we were brought up. But she talks more about You know being aware and recognizing that you have with unconscious bias, and then making a change for the better. And I think that really ties into what we’ve already talked about. So yeah she’s great
[00:28:12] And then I guess finally I can’t not mention the fantastic mentors that I have had at BMD and I my first couple of project managers they were really really really great fellows that I worked with and they definitely empowered me to where I am now
[00:28:26] Mel: [00:28:26] Excellent Yeah It’s it’s it takes a tribe in many ways for many things to
[00:28:31] Lauren: [00:28:31] Yeah
[00:28:31] Mel: [00:28:31] rise up to raise a person. oh well,
[00:28:35] Thank you for joining us It’s been a wonderful conversation
[00:28:38] Dom: [00:28:38] Yeah, thanks so much for joining us
[00:28:40] Lauren: [00:28:40] thank you so much It’s been lovely
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